HUMANS, GET OFF YOUR KNEES, David Icke interview by Bill Ryan of Project Avalon. A must see video!

 Hi Berry,

 The first time I heard Mr Icke was on the "60 Minutes" TV program years ago. I just can't go there. If someone I know spoke of some human beings as being reptilians in disguise I would assume they were psychotic and I would try to get them help. He is so interesting and appears to be so sincere that it hurts to say this.

Peace-Brian

Brian I know how you feel. I've always been a bit apprehensive about some of his material, but I did meet a girl once who gave off a very "reptilian" vibe. She was terrifying. Might have been the beers though. Still a lot of what he says is interesting, and correlates with other things I've heard.

When I first heard of David Icke it was during the time I was investigating 9-11 and such things as scalar/torsion (HAARP related) wave technology.   I didn't even bother to look into what he was saying, wasn't interested in the least, but then again, I was not interested in anything 9-11 shortly before that period of time.

I then came to find later on that history (as you know) is inundated with reptile/dragon type myth, and the work of Zecharia Sitchin came up at one point.  And then just recently I listened to Dan Winter relating to the Draco star system myth of origin.  It has been coming up for me ever since I heard someone from this portal early on say he had actually seen one of these shape shifters change just ever so briefly while driving down the highway one day.  It was very brief, but Dave is as solid a guy as I have ever known, so I had to extend some credit to his real life testimony.

What really allows me to make room for such possibilities is my past few years learning curve has been nothing but breaking of the limits of my understanding and worldview of possibilities.  I finally just plain took the governer off and allow for anything to be possible now.  Another thing that caught my eye was how much of the most recent data I have come across relates to other sources and data that had absolutely nothing to do with this particular subject at the time, but becomes subjects of recall while reading that link I placed in first post above.  It is an excellent well-rounded synopsis of much I have come to at least read about, if not resonate with on some level that is hard to explain.

I know it could be just a case of traveling too far down the rabbit hole, but I have no choice (or have given myself no other choice) but to trust my instincts and intuitions at this point because what I am completely sure of is that we have been lied to over and over and over again by those who were in position to write about human history "officially".  And all of the data from other more ancient (Sumerian, Zulu, Shamanic, Indigenous, etc.) is pretty much ignored by "modern man".  Think about all we were not taught in school about human history and you will get the point.

So where do myths come from?  I do not write this to convince anyone of anything, for that would just reveal people with minds not their own.  I write this only to share that I am you just a bit further down the rabbit hole.  I thought all of this was complete hogwash, all of it, from conspiracies about Oklahoma City and 9-11 to dungeons below Vatican City where human sacrifices take place, to demons that look like dragons/reptiles.

I do ask you this as a rhetorical question though.  Why should any of this surprise us?  Because it is just too shocking to our present senses and sensibilities?  Information overload?  Really, why should anything surprise us anymore, given the things we have come to believe and understand that we shunned prior to the moment of understanding, or at least highly suspecting to be true?  This is why I like that video, Slavery and the 8 Veils, to remind us that we as human beings seem to have this thing about psychological limits - "well, I can believe that, but I must stop here and go no further!"  "this is just plain getting way to out there and crazy for me!"

What's funny is that that same mechanism is the same place that mundane prejudices come from concerning our own species (when they look just a bit different from us, even though their DNA is 99.999% the same as ours).  Again, I mention all of this only because I was saying exactly what you are saying Brian just a very short while ago.  This is all anecdotal and therefore means absolutely nothing concerning real proof, but then again we are way past our definition of empirical evidence in the areas we have been treading and looking into for some time now.

If you are interested in the least, read the synopsis and watch the 8 veils video at the links in my other post above, and then at least you will have a feel for what many are talking about concerning this very bizarre possibility concerning our human origins on this planet.  Like I say, there are many other sources that I had come across having nothing to do with the David Icke and Zecharia Sitchin (Sumerian tablets) subject matter, but came to mind lately when looking further into this extreme subject matter.  And I did not get any of this present accepted understanding I have acquired from David Icke either.  I had felt from the beginning that he was just a sensationalist fear monger, prior to listening to him speak on Project Avalon with Bill, but he is now beginning to sound like someone who has consolidated his understanding to fit an overall humankind transition/ascension in progress that fits well with many other sources I have come to trust, so that was somewhat refreshing.

I guess what I really want you two to understand is that some of us here at the G-Spot understand your current position better than you might think.  I am not as much a flake as my alliance with some of this bizarre data would allude to, LOL

This goes well with what Dan Winter was talking about from his perspective.  The following link is an excellent complimentary synopsis of so much David is talking about in the video.  It would seem we need do little more than have our eyes open lately to finally understand what was and is going on...

THE ALPHA DRACONIAN STRAIN: HOW PLANET EARTH IS MANIPULATED BY A REPTILIAN RACE FROM THE STARS

and this

Slavery and the 8 Veils | Gathering Spot

http://www.gatheringspot.net/video/personalspiritual-growth/dan-winter-o...

Hi All-

Chris- I agree with you, David Icke used to sound like a charlatan but not anymore. Much of what is wrong with the world can be explained by a banker's conspiracy or plain ol' human greed. This can explain the constant wars, and much of the ecological disasters but not all of it - the chemtrails seem to be polluting all water with aluminum, the bp oil disaster is only getting worse with BP's adding poisons to the water. If Lucifer is doing this to provide us with learning oportunities, he's not doing a very good job, since he may actually be killing us all off - polluting the school beyond the point where it is usable.  This leaves the possibility, perhaps probability that outsiders may be doing this to Mother Earth.

Much of what David Icke says agrees with what those who have studied out-of-body are saying. I used to get lost with this talk of different worlds of differing densities and dimensions - I don't anymore. There's a real body of evidence that supports this paradigm. I've always put my faith with scientists - perhaps too much, but when science agrees with ancient religion there's got to be some truth goin' round. The most important message we continue to get at this forum from all different angles and sources is that we create the world we see with our thoughts. I think researchers are actually starting to understand the mechanism behind how this all works.

I think it's dangerous to just go with whatever messages "resonate" with us. This resonance needs to be based on real experience, not programming that we were all given as kids. It's usually difficult to tell the difference unless we have lots of evidence. That's why I'm really exited to learn to travel out-of-body. I haven't made much progress yet but I have made some (got to the vibratory stage). The people who are training others to do this say anyone can learn - you don't need to have special or paranormal abilities, just persistence. Let's all stop guessing at what's in the next valley, trying to decide which traveler to believe and who to not believe, let's climb the mountain ourselves and look with our own eyes. Perhaps out-of-body is not the only path up the hill. There's yoga and meditation as well but I hope we can all start to find out own path toward the truth that isn't based on believing or trusting someone else.

Wendy

ATS: 2) You seem to be suggesting that your methods of physical enslavement are intended to force us into spiritual awakening. But if that is so, why are methods of spiritual suppression used against the general populace (chemicals, organised religion, sociological)? I understand why you obstruct our material lives but not why you obstruct our spiritual development.

HH: Think of it as a "test".

Have you ever noticed, how just when you 'think' you've found something that really "feels" like Truth for you, something will come along to make you doubt it? To make you doubt the truth, and in so doing, to also doubt yourself in believing it?

It happens all the time, in fact, almost every time you have some new revelation that gets you all excited. And it happens, quite by design. You cannot see this however, as it's happening beyond 3rd Density comprehension, in a realm where everything can be seen as adjoining and relating to everything else. Syncronicity. All a magical part of our Infinite Creator's ingenously Creative mind, and excellent sense of humour and irony.

Can you see how the "test" works?

Just when you find something that you've weighed up and dissected with your discernment, and decided to integrate it into your concept of "Truth", along comes the challenge to your newfound beliefs. Usually in the form of an event, or something that 'others' may say to disuede you.

Your Spiritual development, like all other aspects of your progression, is something that you have to work for. How do you know if your newly discovered 'truth' is really True, if you're never tested on it.

The test, is this:

In the face of a challenge, who do you trust?

Do you trust what the "outside world" is showing you?

Or, do you hold fast to that which "feels" ("resonates") like Truth, deep within you?

That is something you can only answer for yourself.

I watched the entire interview yesterday, and as you said, Berry... I took some and left some.  I still think it's worth a watching, but I also can't help but think of the Sleestacks from "Land of the Lost" when he talks about reptilians in disguise.  I understand the metaphor, and kind of remind myself that it doesn't have to be the literal sense of "in disguise" (as in zipping off a suit) or even "reptilian" (as in lizard). I can't tell if he thinks there are ACTUAL reptilians in disguise... Not sure if it matters.  :)

Much love,

Kathy

Just thinking out loud.  Why not reptilian?  We are part reptilian where it truly matters concerning actions and perception.  Right there between the top of our spinal chord and the higher functioning left and right parts of the mammalian human brain is the reptilian part, or brain stem.  "No cause" evolutionists of current popular understanding would have us believe that it is just a leftover from our evolutionary path from ocean dwelling to land and water dwelling, to land dwelling, to monkey to man.

Now if we have been willing to swallow that nonsense for all of modern human history, then why should we find it so difficult to consider the possibility that very ancient and very highly evolved sentient life forms were experimenting with DNA for millions of years, and then the very logical possibility that the reptilian part of the brain was purposefully left in the design because much of the initial experimentation had to do with creating obedient slaves in service to those "creators".

It all sounds so much like science fiction.  Maybe it sounds like science fiction because it has been the subject of science fiction so much of the time in books and movies.  What a perfect way to hide the truth right in front of our eyes.  And then if you talk about it like I am right now you sound like a conspiracy nut.  Is it all designed this well, or was all of it just coincidence and happy accidents?

I was in Architecture for over 20 years and I never once saw a house or building magically appear on my desk from dropping my leadholder.  For DNA to be as complex as it is, there is a much greater probability that conscious coherent thoughtful intelligent design was involved in the process rather than something developing by mere causeless chance over several billion years.  And once that logical issue is settled upon, then come all of the other related questions, once the cause or no cause question is determined rationally and logically, as per the available evidence.

It took me a while to get on the other side of the mirror, but it is beginning to feel much more like the 2nd leg of a round trip, rather than a one way trip to the other side of the mirror...  Like I said, just thinking out loud because this is a very interesting and very pertinent subject, the origin of the species...

reptilian part of the human brain - Google Search

The reptilian mind part certainly made sense to me. I just meant I don't like to think about these reptialian entities - the last time I got that far down teh rabbit hole, I started thinking that I met one (actually in all honesty, as wasted as I may have been that night, it was honestly a strong enough experience to snap me out of my intoxication)

I also like that slavery and the 8 veils movie, its awesome. I want to send it to all my friends - but I don't think most of them are ready. Though we had a good number of conversations this weekend about "conspiracy stuff" after some pints, and they all generally expressed that they "appreciate and accept" my inundating them with such information. It gives them a view they would not have looked into on their own, and even if some of it sounds crazy, they recognize that I have seen truth in it and respect that, and give it at least some consideration (these are guys I lived with for 4 years or so). Mind you these days I try to just say stuff that is easily verifiable, and is starting to leak out in things like the Ancient Aliens documentaries, David Wilcock's work etc.

I admire all of you as you actively try to decide what to believe and what not to believe. I think we have to filter stuff or else we'll end up somewhere strange with no money and a bump on the head. Chris, you say you've taken the governor off but you seem to be scanning what you read or watch with your logical mind-right? If you didn't wouldn't things get rather chaotic and unsafe, or even psychotic?

I LOVED what PLJ4ALL said: "The most important message we continue to get at this forum from all different angles and sources is that we create the world we see with our thoughts. I think researchers are actually starting to understand the mechanism behind how this all works."

 That idea facinates me: that maybe we are engineering reality on the fly(but I mean literally). I don't just mean filtering and perceiving the world the way a psychologist would. If this is so, ANYTHING is possible and it's just our reluctance to create certain things and desire to create others that limits what we experience. So David could be dead right that there are shape-shifting reptilians traipsing around and doing God knows what. Who am I to disagree? BTW-this is fun but I don't talk this way with my kids. And I don't know if you can safely form a life around such presumptions. This conversation seems like a grown-up game.

The governer I am speaking of is society's self-inflicted en mass subtle limitations and boundaries as per the status quo paradigm and common understanding du jour.  This leaves the logical and intuitive mind more free-d up from the insidious confines of peer pressure.  I sense a growing liberation from this subtle, yet very insidious natural force of human nature.

Maybe I'm just getting older and less interested in status quo....  Whatever it is, I like it....

This is not so much a fight against all things "evil", as it is a re-cognition that all is One.  "There's only One of us here", and yet there are all these near infinite number of aspect fractals thinking and feeling like autonomous individuals throughout the Cosmos, only to ultimately find after millions, even billions of years of evolution, that they-we-us-them are all inviolately, inescapably and fundamentally One.

I suspect there are reptilian lines of highly evolved species "out there" (and quite possibly beneath the earth's surface crust), a fairly easy no brainer of a practical guess really, given all the species of reptile/birds we see in our present here and now in 3rd density on Earth.  I think that the Lucifer Group Soul Social Memory Complex may actually have it's origins in the Reptilian line of evolution (tales of the serpent in the bible).  And very possibly Quetzalcoatl, given the stepped pyramid in the Yucatan Peninsula that has the head of a serpent at the base of the stairs, and when the sun hits the pyramid just right a serpentine shadow is cast on the side of the ascending stairs, creating the body of the serpent.

Why all the myth and legends about serpents and dragons?  I really wish that someone had asked Hidden Hand if Lucifer finds there origin in the Reptile category of species in 2nd and 3rd density.  If this is true, than much of the belief in demons exhibited by our humanoid species could very well come from the Luciferian-provided catalyst of serpent and reptile images from there very distant evolutionary past.  The vast majority of testimony from Ayahuasca (DMT)-induced religious/ceremonial visions and images worldwide include benevolent greetings from highly evolved serpent and reptile type beings.  Food for thought...

What I am really getting at is that we may have the over simplistic good guy bad guy "us v. them" thing (so prevalent in dualistic-natured human history) all wrong.  The thing that really helps me see past these strong human tendencies (mammal good, reptile bad, butterfly good, spider bad) is recognizing that there are very good and wonderful individuals representing our particular humanoid species, and there are some real dark seemingly soul-less assholes in that very same humanoid species of ours.  We may not look like reptiles, but we can sure act like our dog eat dog image of "reptiles" at times.  And I am willing to wager that there are advanced species of Reptiles in the Cosmos that would put our present sense and understanding of service to others completely to shame....

I so look forward with happy trust to all that this Creation has to show me/us as all of this awakening process rolls out....  Oh, and Brian, I completely agree with you concerning your kids!  Hell, I don't even tell most adults about what I am considering as a possibility due to personal research and experience!.  The more I learn about the variety of life in the Cosmos, the more I understand and really appreciate the law of free will and confusion (personal right to one's own brand of confusion until such a time when one begins to awaken by sovereign personal free will choice to pursue awakening and re-cognition process)...

Was reading down a bit further, toward the end of the HH Q&A, and someone from ATS actually does address the reptile origin question, in fact, presumes it in their question(s).

HH:  We shall deal with these next two posts together:

ATS 1st questioner: He (HH) is reptilian. That's the race of the bloodlines. They control just about everything behind the scenes.  And remember there's no such thing as a bad race, just select individuals or groups who stand out more than others.

ATS 2nd questioner: Ok, so i have another question for hidden_hand. Reptilians are described as being very aggressive, arrogant and perceive humans to be nothing more than cattle. So what's with the split personalities? you're saying you are loving and spiritual and yet everyone says reptilians are fearsome beings?

HH: That amuses us. We are most certainly NOT Reptilian, and there is nothing remotely reptilian about the True Power Bloodlines. The only 'Reptilian' influences that are in any way remotely involved with this planet at this time, are those of the Zeta Reticuli and Alpha Draconis systems. They are of no particular threat to you.

HH:  For those to whom it may be of some interest, we are of Venusian heritage, originally. What is another name that Venus is called by? Connect the dots.

Oh, and Berry, do you remember who else said they are of Venusian heritage/origin???

above all, remember,

"and when all is said and done, no matter how much one may have suffered in this life-experience, we can never lose sight of the fact that this is a Game we are all playing here together, and each incarnating Soul has already chosen and agreed in advance the parts they will play in the Game. No one really suffers, except in the Game, and ultimately, they have chosen these experiences before hand, at a Soul level. No one is 'forced' to incarnate into a storyline they do not want to play and learn from"

"And remember, no matter the ideologies that may separate us in this Game, the message is all that matters, and the message is, that in the Love, and the Light of our Infinite Creator, we are All One. Brothers and Sisters of the Light"