I feel this is intended to spark alot of emotion Gary. It makes me wonder what the motives of the makers of the video truly are and what group or groups they are actually representative of. I did go looking and the only info on Freiwilligfrei.com is in German(?) so that didn't help me much. If anyone is fluent in the language, maybe they could help us interpret what is found there.

I don't get the impression that it's meant to inform, I get the impression it is meant to incite violence and unrest. Though I am not in total disagreement with what is presented, I find the way it is presented to be almost or potentially dangerous. Viewed by someone teetering on the edge because of emotional upheaval or angry about some perceived social injustice it feels to me like fuel to add to the fire.

I feel like this is also the sort of thing a group like the terrorist groups we see in action around the world would begin with when looking to recruit. I am all for truth and transparency and don't agree with much of what is going on currently in both the military and political arenas, but to me this seems another form of propaganda that we must be wary of as we look closely at it.

For me, I won't waste time dwelling on it or worrying about it because that gives it more energy, but I won't be forwarding it elsewhere either. I appreciate you posting it for us to have a dialogue about because as you've said it did spark something deep within you. It is always good for us to take a look at what that might be so we can work on sorting it out. There's alot wrong with our world but I am not comfortable with their approach being a way to 'fix it'. kristyne

I found this to be right on the mark in many ways, albeit a bit coarse in style. I can't hold that against him when he is doing what so many should constantly be doing these days, trying to spark some critical thinking in the hypnotized dumbed down drone masses of this day and age.

The PTB have clearly been engaged in a program to dumb down the masses, to create a compliant patriotic work force that is not interested in critical thinking, in asking important questions concerning what's really going on.

There has been a program for years now to bolster unmerited self esteem in children as they are growing. when I went to school we got paddled for being out of line and critical thinking and common sense was taught and encouraged. And the bolstering of self esteem came from personally engaging in something constructive and creative, something that creatively exercised mind and body. We didn't get blue ribbons for mere participation, but for exhibiting excellence in personal endeavor.

It is absolutely bizarre these changes in style of education have had on those who are now adults. we even see it in the very bizarre nature of those running for office these days. you can hardly get anyone to blush anymore when they are doing something that is clearly and intuitively wrong!

We are most definitely headed for some kind of cause and effect bump in the road in the relatively near future. don't know how it will play out, but it is big writing on the wall in bold caps man!

so again, I salute anyone who is willing to invoke critical thinking these days, and I see no secret agenda in the speaker's rant. Just one more very pissed off thinking man or woman willing to speak his or her mind in these very weird and crazy times we are living in...

and make no mistake about it, we live today in the USA quite literally in a corrupt fascist police state. most of us are in denial about it simply because it has not affected us yet like it has affected those we have seen on the news of late, primarily African Americans. Big writing on the wall in bold caps man!

Hi all,

I initially felt as you did Kristyne, I have since visited their site and translated a few pages, the following link is some of their most recent postings

Translated page

Unfortunetly most of the video clips are in German

However I am not feeling good vibes about any of it.................something not good is behind this IMHO

Have a great day ................

I was wondering what it was that has made you two feel this way about this video, and then I saw that he was getting even more polarized as he was winding up, using "us v. them" language, railing at the listener that he is addressing as "you". So I think I understand the why, but I personally don't think this guy is attempting to recruit anyone to any terrorist organization, but that's just my personal hunch about it.

I remember another historical radical political religious figure that got this polarized and judgmental in his speech and certainly pissed off the religious and political figures of his day:

Matthew 23New International Version (NIV)

A Warning Against Hypocrisy

23 Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: 2 “The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. 3 So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. 4 They tie up heavy, cumbersome loads and put them on other people’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.

5 “Everything they do is done for people to see: They make their phylacteries[a] wide and the tassels on their garments long; 6 they love the place of honor at banquets and the most important seats in the synagogues; 7 they love to be greeted with respect in the marketplaces and to be called ‘Rabbi’ by others.

8 “But you are not to be called ‘Rabbi,’ for you have one Teacher, and you are all brothers. 9 And do not call anyone on earth ‘father,’ for you have one Father, and he is in heaven. 10 Nor are you to be called instructors, for you have one Instructor, the Messiah. 11 The greatest among you will be your servant. 12 For those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.

Seven Woes on the Teachers of the Law and the Pharisees

13 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the door of the kingdom of heaven in people’s faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to. [14] [b]

15 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when you have succeeded, you make them twice as much a child of hell as you are.

16 “Woe to you, blind guides! You say, ‘If anyone swears by the temple, it means nothing; but anyone who swears by the gold of the temple is bound by that oath.’ 17 You blind fools! Which is greater: the gold, or the temple that makes the gold sacred? 18 You also say, ‘If anyone swears by the altar, it means nothing; but anyone who swears by the gift on the altar is bound by that oath.’ 19 You blind men! Which is greater: the gift, or the altar that makes the gift sacred? 20 Therefore, anyone who swears by the altar swears by it and by everything on it. 21 And anyone who swears by the temple swears by it and by the one who dwells in it. 22 And anyone who swears by heaven swears by God’s throne and by the one who sits on it.

23 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices—mint, dill and cumin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law—justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former. 24 You blind guides! You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel.

25 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You clean the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of greed and self-indulgence. 26 Blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup and dish, and then the outside also will be clean.

27 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of the bones of the dead and everything unclean. 28 In the same way, on the outside you appear to people as righteous but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness.

29 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You build tombs for the prophets and decorate the graves of the righteous. 30 And you say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our ancestors, we would not have taken part with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’ 31 So you testify against yourselves that you are the descendants of those who murdered the prophets. 32 Go ahead, then, and complete what your ancestors started!

33 “You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell? 34 Therefore I am sending you prophets and sages and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town. 35 And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36 Truly I tell you, all this will come on this generation.

37 “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. 38 Look, your house is left to you desolate. 39 For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’[c]”

and the other thing that came to mind is that Jesus was considered by some of his associates to be the new leader of the rebellion that was forming organically in the Jewish community against the Roman occupation. So many parallels to what we see today in the clash of civilizations, the West vs. East.

Judas Iscariot, his childhood friend, tried to force Jesus' hand, the so called betrayal in the Garden of G, because Judas was absolutely sure that Jesus would exercise his divine powers to protect himself and take the position of leader of the forming rebellion against Rome. The Romans, much like the USA today, would consider this kind of rebellion planning to be treasonous and worthy of death.

The USA would consider many of Jesus' associates (especially Judas) to be terrorists, a threat against US interests in the middle east and a threat against the very overused buzz words, "national security".

and Larken Rose is reading (in that video) from his novel, The Iron Web

0243 pc180 Grant’s Speech from The Iron Web by Larken Rose | Bad Quaker Dot Com

and he is a tax protestor

Tax protester history in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Larken Rose - Tax Protester Dossiers

An example of differing opinions, what if Jesus didn't come to be a leader of men, nor start a religion, but to show us how much power is within us ? What if Judas didn't try to force his hand, but instead acted exactly in the manner that he was asked to by his friend even knowing it might be the end of his earthly existence? So many questions and issues we can't really answer except through our own experience...and none of our experiences are exactly the same.

Nor are our interpretations of them at the time and 100 years later(or 2000) necessarily accurate either...kind of ludicrous to think we've gotten the whole story verbatim anyway. There are so many views on what Jesus was/wasn't -did say/didn't and some deny he existed so we could debate that until all of our lifetimes have passed away... I'm not going there in regards to this post.

My concern with the video stems from my own belief that first of all, no one knows exactly what's right for another and I've learned to trust my gut. My intuition is usually pretty right on, so for me to ignore that is unwise. I've not said this is a recruitment video, I've said I believe this could be the kind of rhetoric that has the potential to insight violence. I also looked at Larken Rose' site and Freiwilligfrei.com, neither gave rise to me feeling differently. So for me, I'll trust my gut.

Kudos to anyone wishing to bring things to light, and I think that's what Gary did in posting this. The message of Larken Rose doesn't resonate with me at all because of the way it is presented, not solely based on content. I have never found name calling and treating others as less intelligent, which the above video smacks of, a good way to make a case for or against anything.

I feel the winds of change blowing like the rest of you, and I welcome it if it's change that results in a better world, not just better U.S. and am alarmed at the collective consciousness and karma we as Americans are incurring and have incurred.

My feathers ruffle just a little when the assumption is made that while choosing to focus on peaceful resolution to conflict instead of radical change someone sees the world only through rose colored glasses. I don't have any blinders on-but I choose to hope and work for a future so bright we need to wear shades.

addendum: who wants us to believe what? anyone watching the x-files this week? i wonder!

that was kinda my point (concerning Jesus and interpretation). one person's savior is another person's heretic. one person's freedom fighter is another person's terrorist. as to the other things you get at in the rest of your post, couldn't agree more, with this slight exception.

Sometimes it takes a measure of harsh shocking talk to get sleeping souls' attention. I'm not really defending his style (because I was also put off by it toward the end of his rant), just making an observation in the context of "desperate times may call for desperate measures".

Tough Love, so to speak

My guess is that he has gone radical and rogue and that plays on his psyche, and therefore plays on his delivery style. He is not paying his taxes and is very polarized against the State.

'one person's savior is another person's heretic. one person's freedom fighter is another person's terrorist.'

This certainly is playing out as the day progresses. Been watching the little bit of news filtering out regarding the standoff in Oregon, one man Robert LaVoy Finicum has been shot dead. I wrote a short note and prayer for all those involved and for truth, justice and transparency from all sides when I woke this morning and thought I posted it here but four hours later, no sign of it. Co-ink-ee-dink? I dunno.

My comment was simply that the Constitution and specifically the second amendment was written as they are by our forefathers to protect us (from a distant government) for a reason. If my father was alive, he might be standing with these men, he was devoutly patriotic during his lifetime and spoke often regarding impingement on our Constitutional rights and how much we have and are giving up daily. We must pay attention and do due diligence as this further comes to light... or gets further cloaked in darkness...(not alot of faith in MSM from where I sit).

So I pray first for the families directly involved, for the community affected, for our rights as Americans to freedom of speech and right to peaceful assembly and thusly, for truth and transparency on the part of all involved at every level from local communities up to and including the Federal Government and it's response to this and other situations.

In speaking with a couple 20-30 somethings some of them really don't get the part about government control vs. personal freedoms. I'm not making any judgement calls on who's right or wrong-just God help us all. As we've been discussing things that 'spark alot of emotion', this seems to fit here. kristyne

My wife Kerry is retired now, but worked in the Agribusiness insurance field and is very familiar with this particular area. That land was stolen from the native americans by farmers way back when. some of the decendent native americans showed up to protest the bs protest.

if those so called patriots really wanted to do the right thing they would be for returning the land to the rightful owners. the other part of the agribusiness story is the farm bill has been a welfare check plan for the farmers in that particular area. the US gov pays the farmers not to grow because the land is not good for growing crops. Insult to injury from the perspective of the regional Native Americans.

these "patriotic" protestors are asking the US gov to stay out of their "presumed" business, and yet it is this same gov that pays them money to not grow crops in that area. so the native americans get ripped off, and some of the farmers in that protested area don't want this kind of attention because they kinda have a pretty good deal going with the US Federal Government Farm Bill "welfare program".

it always amazes me that some of the biggest red state type rural complainers concerning the US gov are the very ones depending on the US gov for the money they receive from a very large farm bill, money that covers them when crops fail or don't grow as planned. I have yet to see any of these rural people offer to cut that monetary umbilical cord.

it reminds me of that poster someone was holding at a protest that said, "keep government out of my medicare you damn socialists!" the ultimate irony! protesting the very socialism you are fully engaged in...

I don't at all disagree with what you've said Chris, and that's why I've said I take no sides. I also believe none of us really 'own' the land including the Native Americans. That yes, were here first and have been totally screwed more often than not throughout our history. I have witnessed the appalling conditions under which they live and endure firsthand. We should all be respectful stewards thoughtfully caring for the planet and each other-but it ain't happening man. I greatly respect Indigenous peoples everywhere, their plight and their rights as well. Injustice is injustice regardless of race, creed or color.

How we figure out a way to all live together in this time and place and prosper and treat each other as respected equals is the issue. We can't keep looking backward and blaming everything on events of the past. We have to change it, not repeat it. I know a few farmers personally as well and don't at all agree with some of the policies in place that regulate, subjugate and denegrate their value and livelihood either.

Someone's without their father today, someone elses father/son/husband became a killer today (whether with the authority to do so or not doesn't change it) and another group whether radical or fanatical or just plain pissed off, for a just or unjust cause or just plain stupidity, has made our world at least temporarily a more unstable and violent place. What events will this cause have set into effect-that concerns me. I feel just as bad for the man shot as for the shooter in almost every instance of violence I witness in our news feeds lately.

Now politicians have another topic to pedal on their podiums while filling us full of bullshit rhetoric and promises left unkept. Banging my head against the wall figuratively. Wondering will we ever learn.

Amen Kristyne! And to be sure I am not siding with the US Federal Government. So much of what they are doing, allegedly in our name, makes me ill. Primarily what I'm trying to get at is when someone has a protest sign (protesting the US Gov) in one hand and taxpayer monies from the Farm Bill in the other, it strains credibility.

To bring it back to the original forum post, Larken Rose has more credibility than those protestors in Oregon because he is completely, or at least attempting to completely cut all ties with a government that he adamantly disagrees with, a more honest anarchist IMHO.

And again, I am not siding with Rose, just making an observation concerning consistency, integrity and the epic epidemic of cognitive dissonance these days. As for how all this plays out, it is getting more ridiculous and bizarre by the day. If someone wrote a fictional novel describing all of the strangeness in this present real time, the movie of the book might be called "Idiocracy To"